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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi Guys

I just took out my new Tapron 120 for it's maiden voyage to Sandringham on Port Phillip Bay last Sunday. I had some success on the soft plastics while drifting around the moored yachts, catching a few aussie salmon and a nice dinner sized 40cm flattie.

However while attempting to troll some lures around, I had a few issues, being inexperienced at trolling lures from a kayak I was hoping to get some input from some more experienced forum members...

First issue was that I was trying to troll 2 rods at the same time, 1 out each side of the yak, both pointing slightly above horizontal and slightly forward positioned approx the same location as my foot braces. I was infrequently hitting the lines with my paddle and I felt like I was constantly going to hit the rod or line. I'm guessing the rods I was using were too short - 5'6 baitcaster and 6' spinning rods. Would a longer rod help?

Second issue was while even doing the slightest turn I found one lure would pull around faster than the other and cause the lines to cross and tangle. Should I only use one trolling line? Longer rods? set the lures at different distances from the kayak?

Third issue is that I found most of my lures wern't suitable for trolling. I have more flick and twitch style lures that tended to spin around and round or flip upside down and turn into poppers when paddling along. I had a RMG scorpion 65 that seemed to handle the speed. But I would like to know what lures do you find work well being trolled from the yak? More for our PPB and Western Port species like Salmon, Pike, Snapper, Flatties etc?
 

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Hey Grum,

Can give you an answer to one question, (2nd hand from guy that actually knows his fishing). You will make your life easier if you troll you 2 lures with one with less line out than the other - less likely to tangle. He also advised me to run 2 that were different sizes at different depths or even one on the surface depending on what you are targeting.

The theory was that if it looks like one fish is chasing another smaller fish it triggers fish, especially aggressive strikers to go after the fish being chased before they miss their chance.

Only really got to try it once but it worked. Caught my only ever rat kingfish off the kayak on 4lb braid, 6 lb leader, on a little tinsel fly on a reel I got free with a magazine subscription on a rod with a broken tip! :lol:

Worth a try. Good luck.
 

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Grum said:
First issue was that I was trying to troll 2 rods at the same time, 1 out each side of the yak, both pointing slightly above horizontal and slightly forward positioned approx the same location as my foot braces. I was infrequently hitting the lines with my paddle and I felt like I was constantly going to hit the rod or line. I'm guessing the rods I was using were too short - 5'6 baitcaster and 6' spinning rods. Would a longer rod help?
Yeah, they are a bit short. I normally troll 7 foot rods. That said, hitting your line isn't a bad thing. I've had so many fish strike after touching the line. It just add a jerky action to the lure which rarely hurts.

Grum said:
Second issue was while even doing the slightest turn I found one lure would pull around faster than the other and cause the lines to cross and tangle. Should I only use one trolling line? Longer rods? set the lures at different distances from the kayak?
Both of your lines are too close to the kayak.

I normally have at least 10m on one and 15 on another.

Grum said:
Third issue is that I found most of my lures wern't suitable for trolling. I have more flick and twitch style lures that tended to spin around and round or flip upside down and turn into poppers when paddling along. I had a RMG scorpion 65 that seemed to handle the speed. But I would like to know what lures do you find work well being trolled from the yak? More for our PPB and Western Port species like Salmon, Pike, Snapper, Flatties etc?
I'll let another mexican field this one. I honestly don't know what works down there
 

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Hi Grum. Can you post a picture of your rod holder setup? I might take a guess at it though; two holders at your feet in the gear tracks the Tarpons come with. Perhaps if the rods were elevated to get them out of the way of the paddle, and pointing out square from the kayak to increase the spread of the lines. I think Ram and Railblaza both have height extender options, I know Scotty do.
 

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Best way I think is to troll them at different lengths, and always try to turn the way of the lure that is further out. Ive found if you turn the way of the shorter line they always cross and tangle. Hope that helps
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Thanks for the pointers guys. Weather pending I'll give it another crack this weekend with some longer rods and letting more line out the back at different lengths.

Absolutely spot on with the setup, I got two of the Harmony slide trax mounting plates with scotty baitcaster holders. Sorry will have to wait till the weekend before I could put a pic of the setup as it's always dark by the time I get home. Overall not that impressed with the Harmony mounting plates as they are quite bulky, and the thumb screws for adjustment rub against the scotty base. Might give the Yak attack ram balls a crack next, they seem pretty neat!

Might also look at the extenders as they'll make reaching the rod a tad easier if it's farther away.

Anyone tried trolling tassie devils in the salt???
 

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Caught quite a lot of flathead on devils, but still prefer divers.
One thing to think about, is what speed you are trolling at for the target species??
So what are you trying to target?
Cheers
Paul
 

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For snapps I use Storm Deep Thundersticks, slim profile track straight and run at about 4.5m on 8lb braid.
A slow troll is better, about lazy walking speed, not powerwalking speed.
Try to follow your depth contours to keep your lures either just touching or within the bottom meter of water.
Also locate reefs and cockle beds and troll past those, trying to line up as many as you can in one direction troll then back past them again on the return.
Cockle beds produce more snapper for me than do reefs.
 

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Grum said:
First issue was that I was trying to troll 2 rods at the same time, 1 out each side of the yak, both pointing slightly above horizontal and slightly forward positioned approx the same location as my foot braces.

Second issue was while even doing the slightest turn I found one lure would pull around faster than the other and cause the lines to cross and tangle.

I had a RMG scorpion 65 that seemed to handle the speed. But I would like to know what lures do you find work well being trolled from the yak?
Grum I think with more paddling experience a lot of your problems will disappear as you get the feel of paddling with rods out as mine are similarly mounted and using 6' rods might only touch the gear a couple of times in any session.

In this picture the left rod is in the normal trolling position, and you can see the opposite holder is identical, and personally see no need for extensions unless you are a pedaller
IMG_0960.JPG


The advice to vary troll line lengths is good as is Bigdyl's comment re the turning direction.

You will find any lure that has it's a towpoint on the bib [like the scorpion] will troll OK, there can be other factors but that style will handle most speeds nicely.
 

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Grum said:
Hi Guys

I just took out my new Tapron 120 for it's maiden voyage to Sandringham on Port Phillip Bay last Sunday. I had some success on the soft plastics while drifting around the moored yachts, catching a few aussie salmon and a nice dinner sized 40cm flattie.

However while attempting to troll some lures around, I had a few issues, being inexperienced at trolling lures from a kayak I was hoping to get some input from some more experienced forum members...

First issue was that I was trying to troll 2 rods at the same time, 1 out each side of the yak, both pointing slightly above horizontal and slightly forward positioned approx the same location as my foot braces. I was infrequently hitting the lines with my paddle and I felt like I was constantly going to hit the rod or line. I'm guessing the rods I was using were too short - 5'6 baitcaster and 6' spinning rods. Would a longer rod help?

Second issue was while even doing the slightest turn I found one lure would pull around faster than the other and cause the lines to cross and tangle. Should I only use one trolling line? Longer rods? set the lures at different distances from the kayak?

Third issue is that I found most of my lures wern't suitable for trolling. I have more flick and twitch style lures that tended to spin around and round or flip upside down and turn into poppers when paddling along. I had a RMG scorpion 65 that seemed to handle the speed. But I would like to know what lures do you find work well being trolled from the yak? More for our PPB and Western Port species like Salmon, Pike, Snapper, Flatties etc?
I'll chime in as I have the exact same setup and troll regularly.

As some have indicated you are probably trolling too close. I usually have at least 20-30m out to have the yak clear of the fish (also for depth and visibility reasons). For trout (not so relevant to salt though) I may even have 70m or so out.

Also agree your lures need to be staggered. This both helps avoid tangles, lets the lures clear each other in turns and if you get a hookup that brings the lines close, I run 1 to 5m between the two. Gotta strongly disagree with Barrabundy though. I would always troll the deeper lure at the back, reason being that alot of fish will get fired by the shallow lure going over then hit the deeper lure as it's closer to them. More problematic though is if you have the deep lure closer some fish will spook if something comes up from behind and beneath them (many fish, bar salmon and such, will be looking up), so your second lure may be ineffective.

As far as lures anything with a bib or that holds depth is probably going to work in the salt. Starting out I would recommend suspending or floating lures (suspending are better IMO, more hookups when stationary but that's another tactic) as sinking lures are pretty likely to result in your second rod snagging while fighting a fish. And yep tassies do work in the salt, salmon and flatties have eaten them in my experience. Many salt fish will rise for the lure but as others have said too getting it down and closer to the bottom will likely temp more strikes. If you are fishing small lures then Min Mins and Sebile koolies will get you more depth.

Re: your setup as I said I use everything the same basically. Rods are 6ft. I have the holders well forward and they don't ever foul the paddle. I don't really have problems with the scotty holders with base plates myself. Yes the line does get 'crossed' around your back when turning but I usually flick it onto my shoulder while i complete the turn, seems to stop it tangling. I don't have the rods angled forward as I'm of the opinion it adversely affects hookups. 90 degrees or slightly back for me. I have the rod tips low to the water also.

It may be useful getting used to one rod first then going to two, that's what I did (i didn't even have a second rod for trolling at the time though lol)

With the above setup I rarely get tangled up (I do mean rarely, maybe once every four to six trips), even when I have a fish on.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Thanks for all the feedback guys, it's given me a few things to work with on my next trip out. I think trial and error will reveal the best methods, and you have given me a few to work with.

Also I think I MUST go buy some new lures... Absolutely no choice in the matter... I just have to convince the wife! Wish me luck!

Stonker of a bass there Dodge.
 

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Hi Grum,

I use Scotty rod holder with the extension arms and have had very few problems with line tangles etc. They lift the rods up and out while you paddle and give you extra width on the rods.

The only time have had a problem with tangling was during high winds when trolling with a lot of line out

Hope this helps

you can see the set up in the attached photo

Mjos
 

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I am being mostly repetitive but still.

1 long. I do a full cast + 10 paddle strokes. Surface lure/ shallow lure/ unweighted plastic ( I like paddle tails)
1 short.i do a full cast. Deep diver.

That's for off shore. In the estuaries shorten up to help navigation and obstacle avoidance. But you still need length for the lure to work. And be careful with the diver, I like spend the day paddling, not fighting snags.

I don't know PPB either, but for estuary things like the SX45 work well and will make you slow down. If I'm paddling faster I have found the rappalas work well. As I said I like paddle tails on SPs but better fisho's than me say I have this wrong and use stick bait or minnow with no activated action. I think trolling for snapper is more a kind of controlled drift. You want to stop. A lot. For pelagics a steady cruise is good. If you are a paddling quickly between spots but leaving the lures out, I find you need the right lure to keep working smoothly. Rappalas for me.

Unlike Rricho I find the forward rod holders are a bastard for paddling, especially since I started getting more serious with the paddle. On my Swing I'd use one forward only and the other behind. I still kept clouding the rod. Add in 8" extension to the rod holder to get the rod above the deck. That worked for me on the swing.

The famous BBW used this set up on the Swing and used to recommend forward rods so he could watch the rod tips for fish taps. I don't like it because of the paddle clash. So on my SIK and on the Stealth I place behind only. If you are precious about your reels note that they will get wet, maybe not so much in estuaries.

As an aside, in estuaries time spent paddling between drift lines, casting/finesse fishing with one rod, and dragging a speculator is good. The speculator can be stink bait, SPs or a lure doesn't matter.

Enjoy!
 

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Like Dru, I never use forward rod holders for trolling. I've had rods so far forward that I could hardly reach them and they were still in the way.
I only ever use rear ones, the ones that stick stright up in the air at that.
With one line shorter then the other, I rarely get tangles.
If it's a real tight turn, I'll wind one in.
In Yeppoon, it was an SP on the short line and a HB on the longer one.
 

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I dont do a lot of trolling but I have no problrm doing so and always use the 2 side front rod holders
and normaly slide the landing net in a front rod holder



one of the problems with using a front rod holder is they need to be forward if you are going to paddle or you will hit the rods
a lot of rod holders you have to pull the rod forward out of the tube
but the style of rod holder in the pic above you just lift the rod straight out the top
making it easy to remove even if the rods are well forward
in fact the front holders are in front of my feet and theres no problem getting a rod in or out of them
even with a good size gummy on

you will note that also picking up the landing net is the same just take the handle and lift it out no twisting around while fighting a fish at your side

although I parked up in the pic below it gives you an idea on my rod holder layout



although the left hand side rod would normaly face out to the left a bit more it was turned to get a better angle at the time as the yak sat that way tied to a snag

also having the rod holders on a solid stainless frame is great for bait fishing larger things and the stainless rack also is handy for sliding the yak through mud on those days when the tide gets a bit low in westernport
 
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