Which Paddle ?

[spongy]

Gday AKFFers,
Those of us who dont have mirage drives rely completely on paddling. Over the years I have been pimping out my kayak to make it more comfortable and functional, but really never thought about the paddle until now. It seems I have neglected one of the most important component of the kayak fishing equipment set.
There are paddles that start from around $50 and go all the way up to $1000. How much do I need to fork out to get a significant improvement on my current paddle?
My current paddle is the factory supplied Quantum paddle which came with the Viking Profish 45. Its an Alloy shaft with plastic blades. The blade is more like a wing or "cupped" shaped compared to the more basic paddles available. However it seems to flex quite a lot which I think is sapping a lot of energy and efficiency from my stroke. It got a rrp price of $75, so its on the bottom of the scale of cheapness. Also some of the reviews on this paddle have been quite poor.
I guess I want a much more efficient paddle so weight and stiffness are important.
Does anyone have any recommendations on type, style and cost? Is a smaller endurance blade suitable for the profish45?

I went to Anaconda (I know not the best place for kayak gear..) and saw their top of the range paddle which is now $215 after 50% discount. I believe it has carbon fibre blades and a composite fibreglass shaft. Weight is around 920gm, and has a fixed 45degree feather, and a slightly smaller blade.
There is also a much cheaper paddle for $60 which has a carbon composite shaft and fibreglass reinforce plastic blade. Weight is 900gm and a fixed 60degree feather.

Both of these paddles looks to be a big improvement over my current paddle, but if anyone has any personal experience with any of these, I'd love to hear from you.


Cheers,
Jeff

[ArWeTherYet]

Look here viewtopic.php?f=3&t=52255

Best place to check out paddles is a dedicated kayak shop, even if its just to see what is a good paddle. I'm sure they have them in Sydney.
I don't like the current range of kayak gear at Anaconda, they use to sell good stuff, but got rid of it and only sell rubbish now.

[SamT]

I can't believe you've lasted so long with the standard Viking paddle. I'll throw my vote in with the other Simply Magic supporters. It makes a huge difference.

[glitzo]

I run a paddle from Adventure Technologies , the Odyssey Carbon FCG ,this is a 2piece paddle with adjustable feather nice and light . I generally go out for around 8 to 10 hrs at a time and have found i fatigue much less with this paddle than others i have used . they cost around $350 .

[dru]

Jeff

Choice needs to be matched to paddle style as much as ability and the use you put it too. The spec for my first upgrade went like this:
NOT wing blade, cupped etc but flat Euroblade.
Glass shaft, carbon not necessary.
Plastic blades are fine, but upgrade may end up glass anyway.
Feather at 60 degrees, 45 is for rough water and surf dedication.
With a high paddling style a length of 215cm was right (I like 212cm now) and squarish shape blades.

You're in Sydney, let me know if you want to spend an hour playing on the weekend. Try a high end carbon, a Greenland stick, and a too long glass paddle.

You will get away with $150, but $230 to $250 will be better. High end carbon starts at $400 through to $600.

[Stevie]

Dru's spot on, Around 210-220cm and 60 Deg for a narrower performance Yak. I have have 215 full carbon one piece for that sort of thing, but for bashing around on a fat plastic yak up river with the boy on a 75cm width Yak, a longer flat cheaper blade 230cm which gets bashed on rocks etc.

You can buy two piece carbon ones that asjust 210-220cm so you can work out preference as you go. Theres some choice in blade size too, and just a small increase in blade size makes a big difference. I like a bigger blade now as Im not doing long distance as much and Im stopping to fish, etc, but back in the day a medium blade was better for long paddles. Fenn, Orka, Knysna, Bennet are nice paddles if you want to spend some bucks. The Fenn 3 or 4 is very popular. Wing paddles do take some getting used too however.

I have bought and sold a few through here:
http://geartrade.com.au/index.php?page=browse

A good place to check em out in the flesh
http://www.oceanpaddler.com/contact-us/

[DennisT]

This might help (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... mVUYKgMGLY). Brett from Stealth South Africa knows paddles ( as he competed for many years in surf ski tournaments). He reckons wing blades are the way to go. You are looking at $ 180 for a fibreglass wing blade and $ 325 for a carbon wing blade.

Hope this helps,

Den

[ArWeTherYet]

Wing blades are best for faster kayaks and paddling in a straight line for short distances. No good for long distances, bracing, paddling backwards or use on the average barge like fishing kayak.

[dru]

This might help (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... mVUYKgMGLY). Brett from Stealth South Africa knows paddles ( as he competed for many years in surf ski tournaments). He reckons wing blades are the way to go. You are looking at $ 180 for a fibreglass wing blade and $ 325 for a carbon wing blade.

Hope this helps,

Den

Brett is a cool guy. Excellent fisher and super paddler. If you want advice on surf ski tournament paddle choice, he's ok. If you want advice on fishing yak paddles (If you have a history of surf ski racing)l also great advice.

Never did speak to him about it in Mozambique, but if he wanted me swapping to wings, it's foolish or premature (but not impossible). If the same advice was to me 6 months ago then it was foolish. If it was 2 years ago it could very easily be safety wise dangerous.

If you are ready for a wing, you already know it. If you dont already know it, flat blade. And dont fall to the bollocks about wings being faster. That only works if your yak is designed for racing. My SIK is 5.5m long, damn narrow, cruises (when I am fit) at 8-9km/h. And I can hit the max hull speed with a flat paddle. The average yak is 4m ish, fat 70cm wide, and honest you can hit max hull speed with a flat blade, whatever your fitness. YOU can.

Stay flat. It's safer.

[Horizon line canoes]

There has been some really good advice on here.

I'd like to take a few lines to clarify some details about paddles and hopefully help some people out in the future.

A wing/cupped/scooped blades is for fast boats - they are designed to optimise the forward stroke and improve efficiency's in this regard by 5 - 10% over a std flat blade. They are horrid in a slow boat. They are not designed to optimise any other stroke and are difficult to use for anything other than forward paddling. To gain this efficiency they need to be relatively rigid - they should never be made in plastic as it down grades the efficiency and still leaves you with a hard to use paddle (lose lose).
It is worth noting that they are harder to use in a forward stroke as well - their instability in the water unless used with precision can degrade their efficiency.

So in short only use a wing paddle if - your boat is quite fast, your keen to study the art of paddling to a relatively high standard and your prepared to buy a decent quality item.

For everyone else:
A flat blade or dihedral blade (one that slopes away at the top and bottom) is easy to use, stabile, easy to be quite efficient and capable of a wide range of strokes.

These tend to come in 2 styles, a shorter wider blade - suited to high angle paddling, or a longer thinner blade suited to low angle paddling.
This angle is the angle of the shaft relative to the water during your forward stroke. top hand above shoulder height is high angle, top hand below shoulder height is low angle.

Most rec paddlers are low angle style - but use a high angle blade... It still works as does a plastic wing paddle, but its not ideal.

Then what makes a large difference and what the original question is asking is the manufacture of the paddle.

Slightly generalised:

Typically a cheap paddle will have an alloy shaft and plastic blades. This results in a heavy unit with flexible blades and a rigid shaft. The blades flex losing your grip on the water, the rigid shaft gives a higher load transfer to your tendons and joints etc.

Typically a premium paddle will have a composite shaft and blades (composite being a mixture of resins and a material such as carbon, kevlar or glass), this results in a lighter weight unit with rigid blades and a flexible shaft. the blades catch your waters and the flexible shaft reduces load on the body.

Between these two points you can improve 1 or 2 of the 3 traits at a time which creates your paddles price range generally $60 - $400.

Now within that there are a variety of methods of construction both within plastic blades and composite blades which is too in depth to dictate here but if people are keen to learn more feel free to email me.

Blade angle - offset. 45 - 60 degrees is the most common. 60 degrees is classically viewed as the ideal angle to reduce windage on the top blade without overflexing the wrists yet flexing them enough to promote healthy body rotation through your stroke. 45 degrees is a little more relaxed stroke - not quite as classically perfect - but then again neither is most peoples forward stroke technique - often favored by low angle paddlers.

Paddle length - how long is your piece of string? Again there is no perfect in imperfect answer to this question, it is effected by the conditions you paddle in, the type of craft your paddling, the distances you paddle as well as your height and strength. So there is no generalised correct length - which is why cheaper paddles tend to be in set sizes and more specialised paddles tend to be custom made to suit the user.

multi piece, adjustable, bent or crank shafts or your std 1 pc shaft can also make a difference and are worth looking into when you consult a professional about your purchase.

Most guys on here will look to paddle 215 - 220cm in length but overall will vary between 210 and 240cm.

Happy Paddling
Ben
Horizon Line Canoes

[dru]

Now we are talking. This is the kind of place everyone should be talking to get advice. Forget Anaconda.

The only thing I would add is: a) buy a (shorter) paddle for high angle style and 1) you will naturally tend to a higher angle style and 2) there is no real added long term injury risk; b) buy a (longer) paddle for low angle and try to use a high style, injury rsik exists. If everything is new, starting from scratch, pick the shorter paddle route, and tend toward a higher style from the start.

Cant help mysefl, one more, any yakker using low angle style should take a Greenland Stick for a test. Great fun, and you may just like it. Stealth paddling too, gotta be an advantage spoinning plastics in shallows.

[Horizon line canoes]

x2 on the lengths call.

green lander talk about a classic. Sad to say I've never tried one. Maybe I should get Gala to whip one up for me in carbon or is that not purist enough

[dru]

x2 on the lengths call.

green lander talk about a classic. Sad to say I've never tried one. Maybe I should get Gala to whip one up for me in carbon or is that not purist enough

Any material suits me. Just as long as it stays true to the shape, none of this widdening out at the blade ends. Max 3" all the way.